I don't think Jim Moore is a stupid guy, he just doesn't know what he's talking about when it comes to professional men's basketball, in particular, the Sonics.
How else can one explain to Moore the difference between Dennis Erickson and Lenny Wilkins; as people, as in stages of adult life, as what is commonplace among college football coaches that haven't won a darn thing (lie your way to a better job) and what is common place among Hall of Fame coach's with a championship ring (his reputation is beyond reproach).
"Wilkens told Bennett that his coaching days were over, and Dennis Erickson said he'd stay at Idaho, too." Jim Moore, Seattle-PI
Lenny said his coaching days are over, how about if Jim Moore does not infer that Lenny is a liar. It's just an embarrassment to Moore to make the comparison.
The majority of his story hangs on Lenny being a liar, so, that's out the window.
Bob Hill very well might not last the season, but it will not be Wilkins coming in to replace him.
The dark horse: Rudy T
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December 21, 2006
December 16, 2006
Pool the Talent into Fewer Players
I watched the end and then the beginning of the replay of the Sonics vs. the Cavs last night. Life without Ray both sucks and blows. The earlybirds chirping that the team was fine without Ray are likely pretty quiet this morning.
Ray is out, so Earl starts or is out. The domino effect is that we don't have a another guy in the second unit that can play with Earl or carry the load in a pinch. It's a good role for Earl when Ray is healthy, like Bobby Jackson 4 years ago with the Kings.
So, the team looks bad, and maybe somebody is going to be fired or traded very soon. I'll tilt toward trading somebody, here's why: firing Bob means you still do not have a go-to guy coming off the bench, it isn't going to solve the roster problem. Rick Sund will have to do something. If Ray is out for too long I expect the colimnists (not you beat writers) to start throwing cout coaching names that would not ever happen, Larry Brown, Rudy Tomjanovich, Paul Silas, (or any basketball equivalent to Lew Pinnela would do). Just don't go there.
The roster is the problem, with or without a healthy Ray Allen.
You have 3 guys that don't have a conscience when it comes to shooting the ball:
Ray
Rashard
Earl
Luke is getting there, but he gets timid if he misses a few shots.
Petro will shoot the ball from the elbow every time, I'm ok with that but he's not a go-to guy, third option or off the bench scorer (not yet).
The rest of the players all clutch the ball and pump-fake out on the perimeter. They either don't have the skill to hit that shot, the will to shoot that shot, or the ability to move the ball closer to the rim and create a better opportunity for themselves. Damien is getting better at trying it.
What you have left are rookies, guys on rookie contracts, Danny Fortson's expiring contract, an extra second round pick in each of the next three years, and the December 15th free agent trade deadline passing (or 90 days, whichever is later).
Hill is trying to get Wilcox to step back and be the guy coming off the bench to score while Ray is out, that's what I think he was doing with the roster move yesterday. But that move just points to a hole in the roster for a featured bench player.
I would look for a veteran player that has a couple years left on a slightly bloated contract (somebody making around what Fortson is making) and move Fortson and either a couple second round picks, or a #1 (lotto protected) with one of the kids.
I would look to upgrade a spot not occupied by Ray. Trade many for one. You see one of these former starters get a second life on another team as a bench guy every year. The trick is finding one that can accept a role coming off the bench if they are featured and get regular minutes (that's you too Earl).
Another reason I trade many for one is that we have a bunch of kids already with two second round draft picks coming in the next three years (on top of the first round picks). We are NOT going to have room for 9 more rookies over the next 3 years and the rookies we have right now. We can but don't expect to win any games. I know second rounders don't always make the team, but there's almost no shot at making the team in the next few years as a second rounder with the rooster we have, you might as well trade some of the picks.
I think Swifty is a keeper and the starting center as soon as he can play. Petro is a keeper. Petro might be a good option to fill Wilcox spot if he walks in 3 years.
Sene was a good pick but he doesn't have much of a roster spot. Centers have trade value most of the time.
Collison is the guy they put next to the other guys that are missing their rotations on defense. The center directs and communicates a lot of what has to happen. Nick can do this, Petro and Wilcox both work well with Nick, and you can play Petro and Wilcox together. Those 3 with Swift next year should be plenty of front court. Hill has to pick one of those guys, maybe it is Petro, and regularly post the guy up.
When Ray is healthy Earl can play carry part of that load, but the team needs a backup SF or SG (or a SF/PF tweener) that can catch and shoot, and must defend on the other end of the floor. We need a veteran, other than Earl, that can keep the kids from melting down when Ray and Rashard are not on the floor.
Name the vet that is between 6-7 and 6-9, makes nearly as much as Danny, can play with Earl and one of the three young bigs (all three of Wilcox, Collison, and Petro can play center or PF), can defend, can hit an open shot.
Maybe that type of player isn't the right move, but it looks like what is missing to me.
This team needs to get it's 15 players worth of talent into 9 guys that are actually going to play. We need an upgrade where the team is lacking and not move one of the few parts that isn't struggling.
Trade many for one.
Go Sonics!
Ray is out, so Earl starts or is out. The domino effect is that we don't have a another guy in the second unit that can play with Earl or carry the load in a pinch. It's a good role for Earl when Ray is healthy, like Bobby Jackson 4 years ago with the Kings.
So, the team looks bad, and maybe somebody is going to be fired or traded very soon. I'll tilt toward trading somebody, here's why: firing Bob means you still do not have a go-to guy coming off the bench, it isn't going to solve the roster problem. Rick Sund will have to do something. If Ray is out for too long I expect the colimnists (not you beat writers) to start throwing cout coaching names that would not ever happen, Larry Brown, Rudy Tomjanovich, Paul Silas, (or any basketball equivalent to Lew Pinnela would do). Just don't go there.
The roster is the problem, with or without a healthy Ray Allen.
You have 3 guys that don't have a conscience when it comes to shooting the ball:
Ray
Rashard
Earl
Luke is getting there, but he gets timid if he misses a few shots.
Petro will shoot the ball from the elbow every time, I'm ok with that but he's not a go-to guy, third option or off the bench scorer (not yet).
The rest of the players all clutch the ball and pump-fake out on the perimeter. They either don't have the skill to hit that shot, the will to shoot that shot, or the ability to move the ball closer to the rim and create a better opportunity for themselves. Damien is getting better at trying it.
What you have left are rookies, guys on rookie contracts, Danny Fortson's expiring contract, an extra second round pick in each of the next three years, and the December 15th free agent trade deadline passing (or 90 days, whichever is later).
Hill is trying to get Wilcox to step back and be the guy coming off the bench to score while Ray is out, that's what I think he was doing with the roster move yesterday. But that move just points to a hole in the roster for a featured bench player.
I would look for a veteran player that has a couple years left on a slightly bloated contract (somebody making around what Fortson is making) and move Fortson and either a couple second round picks, or a #1 (lotto protected) with one of the kids.
I would look to upgrade a spot not occupied by Ray. Trade many for one. You see one of these former starters get a second life on another team as a bench guy every year. The trick is finding one that can accept a role coming off the bench if they are featured and get regular minutes (that's you too Earl).
Another reason I trade many for one is that we have a bunch of kids already with two second round draft picks coming in the next three years (on top of the first round picks). We are NOT going to have room for 9 more rookies over the next 3 years and the rookies we have right now. We can but don't expect to win any games. I know second rounders don't always make the team, but there's almost no shot at making the team in the next few years as a second rounder with the rooster we have, you might as well trade some of the picks.
I think Swifty is a keeper and the starting center as soon as he can play. Petro is a keeper. Petro might be a good option to fill Wilcox spot if he walks in 3 years.
Sene was a good pick but he doesn't have much of a roster spot. Centers have trade value most of the time.
Collison is the guy they put next to the other guys that are missing their rotations on defense. The center directs and communicates a lot of what has to happen. Nick can do this, Petro and Wilcox both work well with Nick, and you can play Petro and Wilcox together. Those 3 with Swift next year should be plenty of front court. Hill has to pick one of those guys, maybe it is Petro, and regularly post the guy up.
When Ray is healthy Earl can play carry part of that load, but the team needs a backup SF or SG (or a SF/PF tweener) that can catch and shoot, and must defend on the other end of the floor. We need a veteran, other than Earl, that can keep the kids from melting down when Ray and Rashard are not on the floor.
Name the vet that is between 6-7 and 6-9, makes nearly as much as Danny, can play with Earl and one of the three young bigs (all three of Wilcox, Collison, and Petro can play center or PF), can defend, can hit an open shot.
Maybe that type of player isn't the right move, but it looks like what is missing to me.
This team needs to get it's 15 players worth of talent into 9 guys that are actually going to play. We need an upgrade where the team is lacking and not move one of the few parts that isn't struggling.
Trade many for one.
Go Sonics!
December 09, 2006
Consider the Source
Consider the Source
SEATTLE - As was reported in the Tacoma News Tribune today, Frank Hughes reports that Desmond Mason thinks that the Sonics would have been better had the kept the roster from 2001-2002 season together.
Just so we all know what team he's talking about, here's the roster:
Vin Baker $11,250,000
Brent Barry $4,680,000
Calvin Booth $4,539,000
Predrag Drobnjak $478,558
Antonio Harvey $715,850
Jerome James $465,850
Rashard Lewis $4,413,375
Randy Livingston $653,350
Art Long $465,850
Desmond Mason $1,155,240
Olumide Oyedeji $465,850
Gary Payton $12,926,493
Vladimir Radmanovic $1,452,000
Ansu Sesay $332,817
Earl Watson $332,817
Shammond Williams $1,750,000
Ruben Wolkowyski $545,385
Source - Basketball-Reference.com
I'm not sure that I really have to write too much more, but seeing Mason's comments I am convinced that there is at least three people that will need an explanation (that's you Shammond, Radmanovic and Mason).
Let's take a closer look, just once.
Vin Baker was just cut by the Timberwolves. His prime basketball years were spend as a drunk. He's not on the same planet as Chris Wilcox or Nick Collison.
Gary Payton would just now be making around $17 million. He would be the third guard on the current Sonics roster. Luke Ridnour or Gary Payton right now? If you have answered Gary Payton then you haven't watched a basketball game in the past 3 years.
Brent Barry, remember him? He's a great guy, a great shooter, and would be the worst defender we would have if he were in the Sonics roster right now. He doesn't look too bad with Tim Duncan standing behind him, and Vin Baker isn't anything close to Tim Duncan. Brent is making $5,117,880, and will make $5,554,370 next year.
Hmm, 35 year old Brent Barry, or 27 year old Earl Watson? They are making about the same amount of money over the next two years, Watson has two more years beyond that, when he's the ripe old age of 29 (prime years).
Calvin (Boot) Booth or Danny (2 points take down) Fortson? It doesn't matter, one of them was some kind of help two years ago, the other wasn't ever much help.
Drobnjak, Vin Baker and Calvin Booth were so bad that this guy got playing time.
Antonio Harvey, who?
Jerome James. That pile of crap couldn't get playing time on the Knicks. He would be sitting behind Swift (even with the injury), Collison, Petro, Saer Sene, Andreas Glyniadakis, on the depth chart.
Rashard Lewis, still here, actually improved his dribbling and defense a little bit this past year. He benefitted from the coaching of Bob Hill. Players actually improving under the coaching of Nate McMillan was rare.
Earl Watson was on that roster, but was left off of the playoff roster, and left the coach and team that didn't appreciate what they had.
Ansu Sesay: Desmond Farmer.
Shammond Williams. Where do I begin? The Sonic fan's term for dribbling too much and hogging the ball is called "Shammond-ing" the ball. Shammond Williams is no Mike Wilks.
Olumide Oyedeji, he never turned into an actual basketball player.
Art Long, it wasn't too bad having a guy coming off the bench that was willing to set a hard screen (since Vin Baker wasn't about to do it). Too bad Nate McMillan left him off the playoff roster too. He also had a bad knee.
Desmond Mason, the debate is over Mason (17th pick overall, making $8 million dollars this year for NO) and Damien Wilkins (undrafted, making $2.7 million this year). Gosh, it is a great debate, too bad for Mason that he's being compared to an undrafted player that is entering his 3rd year in the league, while he's entering his 7th.
Vladimir Radmanovic. The Sonics could use another shooter, he could have taken 42 million dollars from the Sonics but opted to take a one year deal. He ended up with a 30 million dollar deal. Do the math Radmanovic!
His best year was stepping in for Vin "dislocated toes" Baker in that 2001 - 2002 season and performing quite well. He hasn't played that well since then, not even close. He's a 6-10 3-point shooting backup small forward that chose not to make an effort to be a good defender.
Radmanovic was moved out and Earl Watson was moved in. The team is better with that one move.
Ruben Wolkowyski meet Andreas Glyniadakis. One of you is willing (as Kevin Calabro would say) to lay some lumber on somebody. The other is helping the opponent up off the floor while the game passes you by.
I'm not about to compare Nate McMillan's coaching to Bob Hill's. I've blotted out the bad memories of Nate McMillan's "coach by feel" bullshit. The jury is still out on Bob Hill's in-game coaching, but it is light-years ahead of Nate McMillan's.
Hill has gotten his young players to understand that they need to work on their games in the summer, and he actually gave them instructions on how to get better. McMillan got his players to understand that they do not get to play unless the got better, and getting better was left up to the player. There has been more player development over the past 10 months than there has been over the past 10 years.
Hey, where's Ray Allen in all this? That's right, the rest of the team would be better that the 2001 - 2002 team without Ray Allen in the equation.
Ray Allen is a better shooter than anybody on either roster. He's a better defender than the guy he replaced (that's Brent Barry at shooting guard, and I know that isn't saying much). He's been a better leader to the younger players. than GP ever was.
As for Howard Schultz not selling the team, It wasn't all up to Howard. I don't think Howard would be owning the team no matter what happened, short of winning a championship. The 2001 - 2002 roster wasn't going to get there before Gary Payton's prime years had run out. The team was bleeding money and the other owners had enough.
I'm not so sure that the other roster would have been better, maybe the first year or two, but not in year 3, not to the Wstern Conference Finals, but they didn't have a future. The future is where Clay Bennett and this roster is heading. A team with a future could be imagined to be playing in a new arena, in the future.
Desmond Mason, and the what could have been, should be left in the past.
SEATTLE - As was reported in the Tacoma News Tribune today, Frank Hughes reports that Desmond Mason thinks that the Sonics would have been better had the kept the roster from 2001-2002 season together.
Mason took the time to speak with former Sonics players Shammond Williams and Vladimir Radmanovic, and Mason said all three came to agreement on one thing:
If the Sonics had not broken up the team in 2001 by trading Gary Payton and Mason to Milwaukee for Ray Allen, Kevin Ollie and Ronald Murray, the team would have achieved more success and Howard Schultz would not have felt compelled to sell to Clay Bennett.
"Honestly, if we could have kept that group of guys together... the outcome would have been a little different," Mason said before the Sonics hosted the Hornets Friday night at KeyArena. "That is what good teams are made of, like Detroit and San Antonio, they keep their guys around, they let them grow together, they let them play together and learn each other. You can get good that way.
"When you keep cycling guys in and out, it is hard to get a good feel for basketball. I honestly think the situation would be better. I think Nate (McMillan) would still be here and Howard would still be owner." Frank Hughes,Tacoma News, Inc.
Just so we all know what team he's talking about, here's the roster:
Vin Baker $11,250,000
Brent Barry $4,680,000
Calvin Booth $4,539,000
Predrag Drobnjak $478,558
Antonio Harvey $715,850
Jerome James $465,850
Rashard Lewis $4,413,375
Randy Livingston $653,350
Art Long $465,850
Desmond Mason $1,155,240
Olumide Oyedeji $465,850
Gary Payton $12,926,493
Vladimir Radmanovic $1,452,000
Ansu Sesay $332,817
Earl Watson $332,817
Shammond Williams $1,750,000
Ruben Wolkowyski $545,385
Source - Basketball-Reference.com
I'm not sure that I really have to write too much more, but seeing Mason's comments I am convinced that there is at least three people that will need an explanation (that's you Shammond, Radmanovic and Mason).
Let's take a closer look, just once.
Vin Baker was just cut by the Timberwolves. His prime basketball years were spend as a drunk. He's not on the same planet as Chris Wilcox or Nick Collison.
Gary Payton would just now be making around $17 million. He would be the third guard on the current Sonics roster. Luke Ridnour or Gary Payton right now? If you have answered Gary Payton then you haven't watched a basketball game in the past 3 years.
Brent Barry, remember him? He's a great guy, a great shooter, and would be the worst defender we would have if he were in the Sonics roster right now. He doesn't look too bad with Tim Duncan standing behind him, and Vin Baker isn't anything close to Tim Duncan. Brent is making $5,117,880, and will make $5,554,370 next year.
Hmm, 35 year old Brent Barry, or 27 year old Earl Watson? They are making about the same amount of money over the next two years, Watson has two more years beyond that, when he's the ripe old age of 29 (prime years).
Calvin (Boot) Booth or Danny (2 points take down) Fortson? It doesn't matter, one of them was some kind of help two years ago, the other wasn't ever much help.
Drobnjak, Vin Baker and Calvin Booth were so bad that this guy got playing time.
Antonio Harvey, who?
Jerome James. That pile of crap couldn't get playing time on the Knicks. He would be sitting behind Swift (even with the injury), Collison, Petro, Saer Sene, Andreas Glyniadakis, on the depth chart.
Rashard Lewis, still here, actually improved his dribbling and defense a little bit this past year. He benefitted from the coaching of Bob Hill. Players actually improving under the coaching of Nate McMillan was rare.
Earl Watson was on that roster, but was left off of the playoff roster, and left the coach and team that didn't appreciate what they had.
Ansu Sesay: Desmond Farmer.
Shammond Williams. Where do I begin? The Sonic fan's term for dribbling too much and hogging the ball is called "Shammond-ing" the ball. Shammond Williams is no Mike Wilks.
Olumide Oyedeji, he never turned into an actual basketball player.
Art Long, it wasn't too bad having a guy coming off the bench that was willing to set a hard screen (since Vin Baker wasn't about to do it). Too bad Nate McMillan left him off the playoff roster too. He also had a bad knee.
Desmond Mason, the debate is over Mason (17th pick overall, making $8 million dollars this year for NO) and Damien Wilkins (undrafted, making $2.7 million this year). Gosh, it is a great debate, too bad for Mason that he's being compared to an undrafted player that is entering his 3rd year in the league, while he's entering his 7th.
Vladimir Radmanovic. The Sonics could use another shooter, he could have taken 42 million dollars from the Sonics but opted to take a one year deal. He ended up with a 30 million dollar deal. Do the math Radmanovic!
His best year was stepping in for Vin "dislocated toes" Baker in that 2001 - 2002 season and performing quite well. He hasn't played that well since then, not even close. He's a 6-10 3-point shooting backup small forward that chose not to make an effort to be a good defender.
Radmanovic was moved out and Earl Watson was moved in. The team is better with that one move.
Ruben Wolkowyski meet Andreas Glyniadakis. One of you is willing (as Kevin Calabro would say) to lay some lumber on somebody. The other is helping the opponent up off the floor while the game passes you by.
I'm not about to compare Nate McMillan's coaching to Bob Hill's. I've blotted out the bad memories of Nate McMillan's "coach by feel" bullshit. The jury is still out on Bob Hill's in-game coaching, but it is light-years ahead of Nate McMillan's.
Hill has gotten his young players to understand that they need to work on their games in the summer, and he actually gave them instructions on how to get better. McMillan got his players to understand that they do not get to play unless the got better, and getting better was left up to the player. There has been more player development over the past 10 months than there has been over the past 10 years.
Hey, where's Ray Allen in all this? That's right, the rest of the team would be better that the 2001 - 2002 team without Ray Allen in the equation.
Ray Allen is a better shooter than anybody on either roster. He's a better defender than the guy he replaced (that's Brent Barry at shooting guard, and I know that isn't saying much). He's been a better leader to the younger players. than GP ever was.
As for Howard Schultz not selling the team, It wasn't all up to Howard. I don't think Howard would be owning the team no matter what happened, short of winning a championship. The 2001 - 2002 roster wasn't going to get there before Gary Payton's prime years had run out. The team was bleeding money and the other owners had enough.
I'm not so sure that the other roster would have been better, maybe the first year or two, but not in year 3, not to the Wstern Conference Finals, but they didn't have a future. The future is where Clay Bennett and this roster is heading. A team with a future could be imagined to be playing in a new arena, in the future.
Desmond Mason, and the what could have been, should be left in the past.
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